Advanced Profile Customization
If you don't want to use panels, then this question has nothing to do with my module and would be better asked in the Drupal forums where you can get help from people much better at theming than me.
Michelle
but are you not the one that set it up to use panels???
Shouldn't you know how I can make it work without panels?
That doesn't make any sense. Because I use panels, I should explain to you how to do it without panels? How does that follow?
At any rate, you can use my old tutorial to do it without panels if you want. What's there will still work but I don't offer any support for it. It also will be more difficult to port to D6 because the theme system has changed.
Michelle
From a designers perspective using panels to lay it out, takes away control of the layout.
Unless I am missing something, there isn't much you can do with CSS to control the look of this module. Which in my opinion is a problem. At any rate, I can see I won't get assistance here with your own module so I will have to figure it out myself.
You're not asking for assistance with my module. You're asking how to do it without my module. So I don't know why you think this is the place to ask. General Drupal questions unrelated to my modules should be asked on drupal.org.
Michelle
NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, I am asking how to do use YOUR module WITHOUT panels.
I don't think you understand how much unnecessary work you have to do to change the layout and style because of it using panels to lay it out.
If it was set up with CSS it would be a snap to change the layout. I didn't even check if it validates yet.
This is the place to ask such a question. As I said before, I will figure it out. Because judging by responses that you gave other people seeking assistance, you don't seem very helpful or like you want to be bothered.
Thanks
I don't seem very helpful?! Do you have any clue the number of hours I have spent these last three years giving Drupal support to people completely for free? I'll give you a hint, it's at least 3 digits, possibly 4. I go out of my way to help people on a regular basis but I'm swamped and I have limits. I can't possibly help everyone do everything and so I focus the bulk of my time on helping people with my modules as that is where I can be most effective.
You keep saying you don't want to use panels. Therefore you can't use my module. Period. It can't be used without panels. There are ways to do user profiles without panels, yes, but they have nothing to do with my module, are not my area of expertise, and not something I can help with. It is in your own best interest to ask general Drupal questions on the drupal.org forum where you have a chance that someone can help you, which is why I sent you there.
Sheesh.
Michelle
I'm rather loathe to post here because it's really off topic and the absurdity of the statements about somebody who is bending over backwards to help someone else who is being so rude. Michelle's restraint in not deleting this thread is well saintly.
However, I will comment in case somebody happens across this thread. The idea that panels doesn't have the most flexible CSS is simply so incorrect it can't be allowed to stand. Not only is the CSS flexible it is possible to provide custom CSS for anything one desires on the page at any level desired. Furthermore it is perfectly possible using the Advanced Profile module as I just spent time working on this on a client site yesterday so I know it is not only possible but works very well with Michelle's great module.
First of all, I don't question whether the module is great or not. I think the idea of this module is by far one of the better modules.
I am criticizing how it is setup though. Depending solely on panels to lay it out is not very smart. You have to do A LOT of unnecessary work in order to get a layout the way I want it.
CSS isn't as flexible as I would like it to be. I did assign IDs for some of the panels and tried to use them in the stylesheets and nothing happened. Some that did work I had to put "#adsflaksdfj-asdfsadf .asdfsadf-asdfasdf {}" before I could even start writing any css. That's a pain in that butt to start writing any code.
Perhaps the panels are a good idea for people that don't know CSS or HTML but for people that want a little more control I think it would be a good idea to not limit the module to panels.
This module is a head start for people to get their profiles set up using panels and will eventually include some advanced features using the panels API. If you don't want to use panels, then this module isn't for you. Saying that using panels isn't very smart not only rude but wildly inaccurate as using panels was the smartest decision I made for this module. If you don't want to use panels, don't use my module. It's pretty simple. There are guides out there for doing panel-less profiles including my old tutorial and a whole section of the handbook dedicated to the core profile module. But to come on my site and complain that I don't have the time to help you because you want to do something my module was never intended to do is ludicrous.
That's likely all I'll have to say on this because I'm only online briefly this morning and then offline for a couple of days unless our trip home gets postponed again (sick husband already delayed it one day)
Michelle
Well Michelle, it's my opinion that making this module depend SOLELY on panels isn't wise, keyword SOLELY.
If you can't handle suggestions and criticism of your module perhaps this module isn't for you.
Your "suggestion" is basically that I dump the module and go back to the tutorial. Really, that's what it boils down to. Panels made the leap from tutorial to module possible. If you can't comprehend that, well, I don't know what more to say. And I need to go start packing, anyway, so that's it from me unless we get delayed some more.
Michelle
You can create custom layouts in Panels very easily. It takes a minimal PHP knowledge, which you say you have, and it's pretty equivalent to coding up the layout yourself except you don't have to worry about the content.
And second, you seem to be badgering Michelle for no really good reason. I guess you're frustrated that she isn't helping you do something her module doesn't do, but welcome to open source. Generally, open source does what it does and if it can't do it, you aren't going to get very far by browbeating the author.
Thanks, merlinofchaos.
One good thing came of this thread. Talking about coding a custom layout gave me an idea for possibly working around a problem I've been having. Will need to do some investigating. :)
Michelle
You are a saint! Thank you for your hard work and commitment to the Drupal community!
I appreciate very much the work that people like you have devoted to making Drupal successful. Please don't let the snide remarks of one person turn irritate you too much. There's always one such person in any crowd who doesn't appreciate the generosity of others.
Thank you again!
Heh, I'm no saint. :) I appreciate the comment, though. It's comments like these that help me keep going when I get frustrated with all the demanding and whining.
Thanks,
Michelle
I'm and old follower of drupal (actually seen the first releases but lost touch with it) and it's been 3 months that i learn everything about drupal and between drupal.org, here, or other websites all i can say is that Michelle is everywhere and gives support for everyone for no return i've been addicted to many CMS and Blogging systems mambo(joomla) plone spip wordpress etc... and there's people making business out for 2 stupid answers while Michelle here's is doing a company's job for free i think you should first thank her for the work she've and then explain calmly what you want to do but still i'm with her when she says without panels she can't help much and you should get a better support at the official drupal forums.
For my part i followed the User Profiles tutorials and i learned so much from it and then installed Advanced profile and it's working great.
Thanks Michelle for everything you do i'm really impressed
/Youness from Morocco
@Youkho - Thanks for this. I've been getting frustrated a lot lately by the amount of time these modules take up but posts like this make it really worthwhile. :)
Michelle
That guy is a jerk!
I am a total newbie. I was stumbling around clueless as to how to use Drupal to build two sites, (one for my biz and one for my family) until I found YOU. Without your hard work I would still be reading my drupal and php book with no light at the end of the tunnel.
Even as a newbie, when I read the Jerks first post I had the idea that you would send him to drupal.org because he said he didn't want to use panels. Having read your old tut, I knew your mod needed panels. the fact that the guy tried to trash you and your hard work which has helped so many people, over something so stupid gals me!
Anyway, thank you so much!!
Wow! that guy was an ass!
Thanks folks. I appreciate the support.
Michelle
It would be nice to know how to insert some of the advanced profile module components "by hand" rather than by panel. I'm about to attempt just that on a new site and for all I know, it might be pretty straightforward.
Let me explain my reasoning for wanting to do it by hand.
1. I'm not in a position to afford VPS or stronger hosting. I'm on shared hosting for my projects.
2. Installing a ton of modules slows my system down and sucks up CPU.
3. So I have to be really, really stingy about which modules I install.
On another site, which I worked on for a few months, I followed the Advanced profile module setup to a T. And everything worked. But I was then committed to usernode + panels + advanced profile. that's two more modules than I really wanted to install to get the functionality I wanted.
This isn't a criticism. I'm just trying to lay out the thinking from this end.
Also, I think panels is a great idea. But I don't work on my sites full-time. I work on them maybe once a week. And so any time I wanted to work on profiles, I had to re-acquaint myself with the whole terminology and paradigm of panels, which took about 20 minutes each week. I got tired of having to reread the explanations of "contexts", "relationships" and the rest. I get why they're there. After 20 minutes, I can more or less figure out how they work. But that's not an efficient use of my time. I'd rather hand code a template page where I declare all my variables at the top and can call them at my leisure throughout.
Also, the fact that panels is GUI-based made editing a slower, more dangerous activity than were I to build a page by hand. No "undo" function. A few wrong clicks and you'd delete a panel that took you 20 minutes to create, along with all its settings....back to the Angry Donuts tutorials to figure out how Panels works again.
Again, I'm not knocking panels or the advanced profile module. Thank you for your dedication, support and vision on these projects. But they're not the best fit for my "lifestyle" and experience and it sounds like they're not the best fit for this other guy, either.
So I'm going to install Advanced Profile and see if there's a way I can pull in the "All About User" block into my hand-written profiles somehow. It might be as easy as calling the proper function. No idea. I'll try to post back in this thread if it goes well. Perhaps it would help the first poster out. I think I get where he's coming from.
Not everyone is going to want to use panels and that's fine. Everyone has to decide for themselves what modules work best for them. (Though, TBH, I don't think the overhead of panels is bad) The problem I have is when someone comes along and tells me I'm wrong to use panels and expects me to spend my time for free to support his choice to not use panels. FWIW, doing this without using panels is what the 2nd version of the tutorial does. It's for 5.x, I don't offer support for it, and it won't be ported, but it's there to learn from.
If you are going to write something up, it would be better to put it on d.o than here as a whole lot more people will see it. Feel free to link to it, but just pasting the text in a comment here would be a waste.
Michelle
Hey Michelle,
I'll do just that. I get where you're coming from. I just wanted to explain what I assumed to be some of the sentiments behind the other guy's post as I think I'm coming from the same place.
Thanks again for the kickass module!
Everybody can call me an ass but as a designer the panels is a little more time consuming to customize the layout of the advanced profile than just using css. I do use the module and I enjoy it. I am working on setting up a website right now that uses this module. Using panels to setup the layout was a little more time consuming than using CSS to lay it out.
Have you even read this thread? If you are a CSS guru and find that easier than panels by all means use that. That doesn't make you an ass. Everyone should use the method that's easiest for them. But if you come on my site and criticize me for how my module works and demand that I support making profiles without panels then, yeah, you're an ass. There's a big difference between the two.
Michelle
I don't recall every demanding anything. Nevertheless, I tire of this. You have created more internet drama. I just asked for some support and you got all defensive. Good luck doing whatever it is you do.
Perhaps read how defensive your first comment seemed to my post and see why I might have turned into an "ass".
Anyways, have a good day, nice life, or whatever it is you do to exist.
LOL! You're too funny. You come back and stir up a month dead post and I'm the one creating drama? You asked me to support you in not using my module. I directed you to the proper support forums rather than simply ignoring the request. I guess that's where I went wrong. Ok, moving on now. This horse has turned to dust.
Michelle
Site contents are licensed under a 